that's it. That's the post. I'm playing Baldur's Gate 3 for the first time and I clearly have no one to talk to about this so I'm just gonna leave it here.
I LOVE SHADOWHEART.
I love her voice acting. Her aesthetic. Her "serious, defensive, a bit hostile" but SUPER soft personality??? I saw her playing with the dog in the camp and my heart melted. I'm not romancing her, but I'm trying to make her my bestie and it feels like I'm approaching a wounded animal who is slowly opening up to me. I look forward to every single dialogue with her, she's in my party 24/7 and I never want her to leave. Even her name is freaking cool. Her story so far is my favorite one (I just started act 2). My character looks like a Sailor Moon wannabe with sparkles and blond long hair and whenever I stand next to Shadowheart, all dressd in black, it creates such a cool contrast. She's my new best friend.
SHADOWHEART I LOVE YOU
Basically all of us Shadowmancers
i swear
It’s all right OP, after playing the Really Shadowheart mod I’ve been feeling the same way. It’s gotten bad, I’m having dreams about her now. I don’t think I’ve ever dreamed about a video character before, at least not one that I can remember this vividly
this but karlach
There is a timeline in which Karlach got as much dev attention as Shadowheart in this one and everything there is infinitely better.
Yeah
Me too 😭
She’s gods favorite princess
my goth princess
Shadowheart is a masterclass in learning how boundaries work. If you try to push her to spill her secrets, she'll clam up and tell you to mind your own business, but if you respect her boundaries, get to know her, and let her open up to you at her own pace, she'll eventually tell you everything.
I also love that you get the best outcomes by just being nice to her and letting her make her own choices.
Yep, it is actually funny how a friend asked me how the fuck I get her to do good decissions without beating like a DC25 Persuasion Check or something, and my answer was just "don't try to tell her what to do, and you get an option without any check if you have enough approval"
I think it is just a perfectly written character, because it makes a lot of sense for her, that it is exactly that way.
Shart mentioned
Seriously though I romanced her in my first playthrough. Probably one of the sweetest and most tender romances in gaming. I loved every part of it, from her offering you wine at the party to hang out and then the beach under the moonlight... chefs kiss
I recently played my first resist durge run, and I have to say she is also incredibly sweet in the cutscene with her if you get the wisdom saving throw.
Obviously it is supposed to be a dark cutscene, but honestly it mostly just surprised me how sweet and caring she was in that moment.
She's just a big softie in need of love.
I LOVE HEEEEEEEER
If you do romance Shadowheart at some point, there’s a mod called Really Shadowheart that leans more into the romance regarding the Act 2 decision and how you interact in act 3
Which erases her canon sexuality to make her more traditional heteronormative wife material. You left that part out.
“Canon sexuality”? Everyone is canonically pansexual, what does that mod do to remove that
It makes her monogamous, because this mod is for the type of Shadowheart fan who thinks that polyamory is only for sluts/whores who are incapable of loving normally (all things I've heard from Shadowheart fans on this subreddit!!), and therefore on Shadowheart's good route the writers were wrong to make her poly.
She rejects you having relationships with other origin companions in the vanilla game so this is just an extension of that. The description says she will still have threesomes or foursomes with you but not like you sleeping with other characters without her. It doesn’t say explicitly you can’t be woman and romance either.
No you dont realize, if they can't have a main character thats exactly like them then they'll have a mental break! We can't respect other people's ( real or imagined) sexuality, only mine is the best!
What are you talking about? Does that just mean it removes her wanting to bang the Drow and Halsin? That doesn’t change her sexuality in any way
Polyamorous people generally feel that their polyamory is part of their sexuality just as much as sexual orientation is. In the same way that for me, NOT being polyamorous is an inherent part of my sexuality just as much as being bisexual.
It is also something that is associated with queer culture though it isn't L, G, B, or T by itself.
So yes — as far as I'm concerned, editing together dialogue to make something that's an inherent part of someone's sexuality more in line with traditional norms is... a partial erasure of that character's sexuality.
I'm well aware that I'm going to be downvoted for this, because this is a subreddit where saying that Shadowheart's romance is healthy because you "fix her" by making her into a tradwife gets hundreds of upvotes. But it's true, so I'll say it anyway.
She is not completely polyamorous to begin with so I don’t think you can say that it is canon that she is anyways. It really just comes across that she is bisexual who is willing to explore other experiences with her partner rather than without.
Shadowheart isn’t poly and has never been poly. She exclusively tells you it’s not ok to romance any other origin characters in the camp, and that’s a hard stop with either path she takes.
Just because the “fling” is an option doesn’t mean she is suddenly poly. That would be like misreading Karlach’s offer for you to fool around while she can’t be touched as her being poly. Karlach is obviously hurting and vulnerable when she says it, and she immediately clarifies monogamy the second she can be touched.
The “fling” option with Halsin and the Drow twins is poorly implemented but still doesn’t do anything to her sexuality. All origin characters have been some form of pansexual to fit the most criterias of tavs, that’s it.
Honestly the insistence of some people that Shadowheart, Karlach and Astarion are definitely and inherently polyamorous is quite funny. Just because they allow their partner to have a thing with Halsin it doesn't necessarily mean they are also poly (you can be okay with your partner being poly without you being poly). Tav is the polyamorous one and the only person in the arrangement who is dating two people at the same time. I think many fans seem to misinterpret the entire thing and consider it a throuple but it isn't anything like it.
Halsin is clearly poly too, yes, but even he is not dating anyone else other than Tav. In fact, Halsin is the only character who outright tells you monogamy isn't for him when you start dating him so he definitely makes his preference clear. The other ones don't say this or express any desire of having multiple romantic partners. You can romance them, ignore Halsin, the drow twins, etc. and at no point they mention wanting poly relationships. So much for them being poly. I'll give the other side this though: Shadowheart does mention that she might have her fun too but it happens only after you open the relationship & she's also flirty with Halsin, but she still doesn't pursue him, just like Astarion doesn't either (in fact he even rejects Halsin's offer for a threesome in one party banter). Karlach also doesn't seem to want to join Tav/Halsin. They are definitely open minded though, but it still is a stretch to call them poly, imho.
But SH/Karlach/Astarion aren't dating Halsin and in fact, after you start dating the druid the topic of your relationship with him never comes up. They don't even acknowledge him in the epilogue as a former partner of yours. The only time where SH/Astarion can have sex with him and Tav is in the brothel but that isn't tied to the poly relationship as you can bring Halsin there and have an orgy without dating him.
Lmfao is all i can say.
It's pixels bud.
But you know it doesn’t erase that right? Erasing would be if it like, stated that she hates polyamory, instead it just removes dialogue lines. Not mentioning is different to erasing. And I really don’t see how it’s sexuality, more of a lifestyle choice. Like a straight person can be as polyamorous as an LGBT+ person. And I have no clue what you’re saying with that last bit, cos making Shart a Selunite does legitimately “fix her”.
??? Wait you're not Shadowheart your point doesn't makes sense
Shadowheart is not poly, she settles with Tav if Tav chooses her and remains single if they don't... If Tav choses her and Halsin, besides the drow twins it's a triangle, in the sense that only Tav is poly with Halsin and SH, but SH and Halsin aren't.
That bullshit with Halsin was just to hamfist Halsin into it, it's extremely poorly implemented and yes, I think that if I am not poly myself I should not have to listen to my partner constantly being flirted with and flirting with someone else. Especially Halsin (I just don't like how he's so eager to get into anyone's pants, no judgement for the people who appreciate that, but it simply isn't for me).
Maybe people hate the way it's implemented and it isn't about hEtErOnOrMaTiViTy at all. My tav is always a woman and always picks SH and Halsin is always ignored at camp. Tell me how am I hEtErOnOrMaTiVe for not being into a dude as a woman, but being into a woman...
Maybe people hate the way it's implemented and it isn't about hEtErOnOrMaTiViTy at all. My tav is always a woman and always picks SH and Halsin is always ignored at camp.
To be fair there have been some weird, unhinged stuff being said by some people directed at Halsin (like calling him a pedo or saying he was fucking that boar you can speak to in the grove) or at their writer (he and SH are written by the same person) like sending even threats to the guy. There have also been people who were definitely hateful towards poly people and demonized polyamory, it definitely happen. Point is, all of which has resulted in people getting extremely defensive and basically assuming that any fan who doesn't like how Larian wrote and implemented this is some incel guy who wants Shadowheart to be a tradwife or a jealous, insecure person who is possesive over their fictional partner.
However, for the most part, fans have mainly criticized how this entire thing was written and implemented which is...quite poor and inconsistent with how the characters were previously written. Yes, Halsin was supposed to be part of the team from early on but his romance option (both the solo and the poly one) was added late into development due to EA players liking him in Early Access. The devs probably figured most fans would prefer a poly relationship instead of breaking up with their partner (that they've spent two acts building a relationship with) just for Halsin so they clearly chose the most popular romance options to be okay with him.
Then they added the act 2 convos that force you to choose a partner in case you were pursuing two at the same time with some half-assed explanations as to why the Origins aren't fine with sharing with each other and called it a day. It's too blatant that you have exactly half of the origin companions (the most popular female romance option - SH, the most popular male option - Astarion & Karlach who is the second most popular overall) being "poly" ONLY with Halsin and ONLY in act 3 - it was the only way for the devs to cater to as many players as possible. If they were poly, you would think the game would've made it clear from the beginning but no. It's clear they were not written with polyamory as a concept to their character and romance paths and that this whole aspect was a late addition. (edit: proof - Larian's former lead romance writer DID pretty much confirm this in interviews)
Tell me how am I hEtErOnOrMaTiVe for not being into a dude as a woman, but being into a woman...
Oh some will probably say to you just that lol.
I started a run thinking Astarion and Shadowheart were poly and sadly learnt I was wrong by the end of act 1. But think the game does a good job telling you they are up for an open relationship when things click for them, which is fair enough.
But cracked up when asking Halsing what do they think of their relationship with Tav AB [after bear], doesn’t he say something along the lines of: no one belongs to anyone, why labels if nature is free? The funniest druid poly shit, I obviously requested a lil smooch after that :*
Maybe, if Shadowheart did not outright refuse a poly relationship with Karlach after Shar temple in act 2 and demand you pick between them... Karlach whom she spends hella time flirting with, so she deffo isn't poly, she's just adventurous, which is neither bad nor good, I just wish I could set boundaries since I am not.
What does it do? I don’t have mods.
Chk
Exactly. Istik has no taste.
She's consuming my soul too and I let her do just that <3
I’m with ya OP, I’m with ya.
“I can fix her” -OP in chapter 2
Jennifer English does such a great job with bringing the character to life. Join the Shart cult, you’ll never regret it.
i love my little religious fanatic
I wasn't expecting to love her so much. I've mostly played BG3 with my partner, and we always split the party - she usually has Gale and Shadowheart and Astarion, and I play with Lazael, Karlach, and Wyll. My partner always romances Shadowheart, I always romance Karlach, we've done like four playthroughs that way. Actually once she went for Astarion and I went for Wyll, and both of us pined for our other half lol.
Recently, I started my very first solo playthrough. So suddenly I'm getting all the banter and dialogue with Shadowheart. SHE IS THE BEST! They wrote her so well.
Honesty, her name is the thing I like least about her - it just feels a bit pretentious to me.
Other than that, it’s rare that she’s not in my party.
It is a cult psuedonym rather than a name.
It IS a name. Her parents even have dialogue about how shitty it would be for them to disrespect their child's choice of name.
And the other Sharran kids bullied her for choosing it.
It’s really not, though - she always uses it. It’s a name she gave herself, and insists on using, even in the story track where she abandons Shar and the cult.
She definitely has a normal name though, even though we may not learn what it is.
You learn her old name, and everyone except Minthara respects her actual chosen name.
I kinda suspect that the reason she sticks with “Shadowheart” either way was for development simplicity more than character grounded. It seems like she’d be glad to be called by her rediscovered name her loved ones call her.
As she tells her parents in the cutscene, abandoning her identity in favor of her old name - one she has literally forgotten and not used for decades - is not something she wants. And yes, it’s possible that was done so they didn’t have to record alternate lines for all of act 3 calling her Jenevelle… but it’s also not unrealistic for her to feel that way.
Yeah; they try to ground it. But my guess is keeping things was a motivation for doing so.
Which is a valid reason! Resources are never unlimited, and we probably really like the content they made instead of having her be able to switch names.
I also when I played here as origin first kinda felt like she would want her old name, but as a companion she quite clearly doesn't, and I don't think that is just to make it easier for devs.
I think the scenes are supposed to make the point that good parents should respect their childrens choices, and I think the game makes that point very well.
Except that they literally have dialogue where they say that they're glad to respect her new name.
If you play as Shadowheart, in the epilogue everyone except Minthara addresses you as Shadowheart. This isn't a development convenience, it was a deliberate choice. The evilest party member is the only one who uses her old name.
My personal interpretation is that she'd go by both. Turn one into a middle name or something. But that's just me.
There is a narrator line in an origin Shadowheart run which implies that she is mostly using her original name.
Afaik you only hear it if you rescue her parents and live at the farm without romancing anyone. It goes something like "A letter arrived adressed to Shadowheart, a name few people call you anymore these days."
So she's propably using Shadowheart when interacting with the core party members and maybe her parents but with anyone else it's just Jenevelle.
Minthara is love. Minthara is life 💜😘
Oh don't get me wrong, she's wonderful. But she is most definitely evil.
I'm not sure that's why they had her use Shadowheart's old name in the epilogue, but the fact remains that out of all 9 companions she's the only one who does.
I remember her going back to using both in the epilogue. Just give her time to heal. Shadowheart is her chosen name to honor Shar, I wouldn't exactly call it voluntary chosen. More like chosen under duress.
As for the other cultists mocking her for it, that's because she was special and everyone besides herself knew it. If it weren't for the name they would have mocked something else...
I have played as Origin Shadowheart. Minthara is the only person aside from Shadowheart's parents to call her by her old name, even in the epilogue.
As a companion, Shadowheart says that "Shadowheart" and [SPOILER] are both part of who she is, which makes sense to me.
The game makes a point of doing a mini-trans allegory with her choice of name. It's not exactly subtle. I don't think they'd set that up and then undermine it.
I have played origin SH too :))
I am talking about the epilogue party, where she comes to terms with both names and uses them interchangeable. That was my contribution to the conversation. If you don’t have any comment on that…
It’s no trans allegory :))) wtf?! That’s her friend who is actually trans :))) Shadowheart is pressured into joining a cult and changing her entire identity under duress, honestly that wouldn’t be a positive allegory for trans people anywhere.
Of course the cult part is not, but when her parents have idle dialogue like "who would hate their child over a name???" and stuff like that, I would say that part is very much supposed to mock parents who won't respect their childrens life choices. Because at that point she wasn't forced into that name anymore, she has chosen to keep it without any pressure.
It's not only about trans people though? It's about parents respecting their children's choices and accepting them. Her character really isn't a trans allegory, she's an allegory for blind piety and cults.
Also, she goes back and uses both names interchangeably in the epilogue. It isn't about the name, it's about her accepting who she is. How her stint with Shar moulded her in the person she is at the end... Considering it about a name, or simply an allegory for trans people is reductive in my point of view.
I literally went into the dialogue files and double checked so that I could "contribute to the conversation."
Minthara is the only one who uses that name in the epilogue.
And Nocturne isn't a trans allegory, she's just trans.
Jennifer English has talked about this in interviews, how even though Shadowheart as a character isn't literally trans a lot of trans people see themselves in her name change story, and she thinks that's nice.
And here, I'll go into the dialogue files again:
Player: You accept your daughter's choice of name?
Arnell: Of course. Only a fool would alienate his child over a name. Shadowheart must determine her own path - that is what the Moonmaiden teaches.
Still, I am... unused to it. I can only hope she forgives a slip of the tongue now and again, until I adapt.
But please, go on and tell me there's no IRL subtext here, and that Shadowheart's name change is bad even though her dad's literally saying that Selune teaches him to respect her choice and he would be a foolish parent if he didn't.
Mate, trans people can see themselves in SH, absolutely, but that doesn't make her a trans allegory.... At all. That's reductive. Gay people can and see themselves in her (being repressed, forced into a life she did not chose for herself, etc) I hate it when people claim some character for a certain identity and refuse to see anything else.
You keep bringing up the same bullshit I don't care about, because AFTER ALL THIS!!! Shadowheart HERSELF no longer has any issues with using Jenevelle... Can you please stop repeating yourself? I already told you that was not my point.
You learn her old Name and you also learn that it is not her "normal" name.
Well she did choose it as a child, as far as I'm aware.
I believe you’re correct. She could change it though. But she doesn’t. To be clear, I find everything else about her delightful. Just not a fan of the name. It’s like meeting a supermodel who’s also into all the same stuff you are, and happens to be single and think you’re cute, and her name is Bertha McSlobbinfat. It’s not a great name. You’re still going out with her.
Lol I guess that's fair. I think it's a silly name but it kind of suits her. In real life yeah I would find it more off putting but still, it grew on me.
And she doesn't strike you as a bit pretentious in the beginning?
Honestly the most I've ever fallen for a fictional character before. She is adorable.
Oh you’re into wounded birds I see
It's funny. Shart is my love interest. Things are going great. The funny part is that she looks like herself but my Tav has filled his mind with all the tadpoles including the outer ring of advanced abilities. He looks like a fucking HORROR SHOW!
It hilarious actually. His face is sooo fucked up. It's blackened like it's burnt. There are huge veins running everywhere. His eyes are black and also look bloody at the same time. To cover it up I used the mirror to make his skin and hair as dark as possible. But it doesn't really help. He looks absolutely diseased and horrible.
And here's Shadowheart... All lovey dovey with him. She always says "you're a sight for sore eyes" and she always down for some smooching... which looks like a scene from the Walking Dead. Hahha
"If you're sure..."
My wife has this vibe, find a Scorpio woman ;).
And one of my friend hates her because she reminds them of their ex 🤣😭 Now I need to know if she was a scorpio ahah
Probably, Scorpios are intense, many people can't handle them, lol.
Meanwhile I did [act 2 spoiler things], she called me a piece of garbage and left with my Blood of Lathander
I meed 4 more “shadowheart approves” to get the act1 romance scene (loyalty 40 right?) and its KILLING ME idk where i can get them im almost finished with the underdark…
Same, I don’t romance her but I love her character. I always put her in this modded outfit and I think she looks sick.
Hell yes team Shadowheart! Might I also introduce you to team Maelle (expedition 33 also voiced by Jennifer English)
omg!!! i can't wait to play expedition 33, heard so many great things about it, but now i'm even more excited if i know she's in it!!!
I had put it off for a while and I regret it - the OST IS SO GOOD. I’m playing Clair Obscur on repeat
Omfg you haven't even seen all the good stuff of her story.
Also go search for a night orchid in act 2 plz, I assume she told you she likes them.
she did!!!!! ;-; where can i find them, btw? are they everywhere in the open or is there a specific place i need to search?
They are not incredibly common but spread over the wilderness in act 2. If you go search I think you should be able to find one, but you could also search for the bg3 wiki article for night orchids and it has 3 coordinates.
One other thing I am going to say as spoilerfree as possible (if you want to to make decissions completely blind just don't open it) good shadowheart is A LOT sweeter than evil shadowheart
If you have trouble finding them, you can use this map (beware, others spoilers galore).
My first romance choice ! I love how the mask drops very easily
it's such good writing to see her walls slowly break down
Yeah, she is a great character! Happy for you!
I love shadowheart but only when she has black hair.
She always comes off as stuck up horse girl to me, but to each their own!
Karlach has my heart.
After reading the comments... Do we realise Shadowheart is a fictional character? I agree that she's very well written and her VA did a spectacular job, but some of us here are taking it too seriously. We need to go to a bar and talk to people. Jesus.
Sometimes I wonder about people - she’s a well written character but I have a feeling some dorks actually feel connections to fictional people. It’s weird. This whole post is odd - like I know what you look and smell like reading this.
Saying you like a character is odd???? I'm a girl btw, not some nerd with cheeto fingers behind a pc. After making this post, I moved on with my life and forgot all about her. I think your comment is weird
Being a woman doesn’t make you any less weird. lmao
You know we can see your comment history right? You didn’t make the post and just move on. You’re commenting consistently to others about the fictional character and your love for her and keep saying she’s like your best friend.
Yes, I know what you look and smell like even though “I’m a girl btw.”
You’re a bit odd - she’s just a fictional character. I get the love for her story and so on but you’re going well beyond this. It’s weird.
I know what you look and smell like
And you're trying to call OP weird?
What is weird? Those that comment like this almost all look the same and you can surmise what they smell like based on life experience.
You're apparently not seeing what a weird statement that is
I bet I struck a nerve and you’re the type of person I’m talking about.
I have no idea what type of person you think I am because you've said nothing but Shart fans are weird and look + smell some kind of way lmao
I never said that Shart fans are all this way. Try again.
oh my god lmao, get help
[deleted]
lol fair point. I call those people weird too when they go over board like OP
Brother, let them be. Most of them must be in their late teens or early 20s. At that age, people are impressionable. Can't blame them, I was like them. Took me some time to get over the fact that Zelda didn't love me because she's not real. At some point they'll wake up and get out and meet people. Live and let live.
yeah, she's the very stereotypically beautiful white woman character so most people latch onto her first
lmao signs you've never actually romanced her
I did on my first playthrough
Brother go to the gym
Edit: my bad dawg I got ptsd from the cyberpunk sub
There’s no Shadowheart at the gym, why would they go there? 🤔
Lady of Loss, not Lady of Gains
That's obviously for selunites because Aylin is a unit.
She is not going to the gym, she just carry her gf around all day
the only time there’s a shadowheart at the gym is when i wear my shadowheart shirt when i go 😤
Username has "lady" in it, talks about playing a Sailor Moon wannabe character
Redditors: brother
Loves a thing about a game.
Goes to a subpage specifically made to discuss things you love about that game.
Makes a post about what they love and why.
Redditor on that very same page: "Get a life, you loser."
Don't get me wrong, there is some absolutely cringy, batshit, incel stuff that gets posted, but this ain't it.
Don't get me wrong, there is some absolutely cringy, batshit, incel stuff that gets posted, but this ain't it.
Would have been if it was a guy posting it.
My bad for not checking their name but my statement still holds up.
Why? They never even confirmed that they are a woman.
They love the character. There was nothing in their post that was sexual or posessive or obsessive.
Maybe a bit cringe, but good-natured and fun.
Have you never encountered a character in media that you loved and gushed over? Whether it because of their writing, backstory, aura, etc.
As long as you are not getting creepy about it, what does it matter?
You are literally on a sub made for this stuff. Just mind your own business, don't be an asshole, and let them gush.
Women on Reddit? That's allowed? I thought we were all NEETs /s
A guy can’t be a sailor moon wannabe and go by lady?
To each their own
Edit:
Since apparently this is needed…
/s
Assuming that every stranger you meet on the Internet is a guy is stupid and sexist. This is true regardless of context, but especially when the stranger has a female username.
It's 2025, pal, women play video games.
It was clearly a joke
What a weird reply 😂
Holy shit go outside
Going outside and being in touch with reality is why I know that sexism on Reddit is stupid and bad.
You don’t seem like a nice person
No one loves you
Did you just assume their gender?
What an awkward comment.
I fucking hate her lol. I started killing her after my first play through. I’d rather have karlach.
I murdered Shadowheart without hesitation in my second playthrough when she put a dagger on Lae'zel's throat.
Shadowheart approves.
then I can die in peace