MapPorn
Map of Palestine from 1769.
Discussion
Back then it was the Bey of Damascus.
Isn't the proper name for the entity "Beylerbeylik"?
So Jorden is part of Palestine?
The original British Mandate of Palestinians include Jordan. With what is now considered, Jordan, being known as the East Bank and Isreal and Palestinian Territorys, being called the west bank. The East Bank was split off and given semi independence by the British in 1921 and was renamed to Trans (east) Jordan. The Trans bit was dropped when Jordan declared independence.
Edit: the Trans part was dropped when Jordan conquered the west bank. Not when they gained independence.
This map wasn’t during the Mandate, it’s the Ottoman province
There was no administrative district called Palestine in 1769. Nor was there an ethnic group, people or nation trying to create one.
The Trans part was also dropped because Jordan had conquered and annexed what is now the West Bank during the 1948 Arab-Israeli War, as they then controlled both banks of the Jordan.
Exactly. It seems most people don’t realize the West Bank has never been a part of an independent Palestine since it was annexed by Jordan right after the 1948 war.
Well also because there has never been an independent Palestine.
Yes, the name “Palestinian” is adopted language and does not refer to any nationality.
Yeah Palestine was more a geographic term that arabs in the region later began calling themselves in the 20th century. It’d be like if after Yugoslavia dissolved there was a country called balkans.
this map is from 1769
Historically, yes, both the names Palestine and Eretz Israel, as a geographical unit, mostly (very generally) referred to an area for which the Jordan River is roughly in the middle, until a bit after WW1.
Jordan took like 80% of mandatory palestine
Have you ever wondered why Palestinians called it "The West Bank"? Because like North and South Korea or North Ireland and Ireland, the Palestinian people think of the West Bank as one part of a more complete entity. This is why Jordan doesn't completely like Palestinians (this and also all the terrorism Palestinians have committed in Jordan).
Jordan is like 40%-50% Palestinian.
Plus a significant % of Jordan’s population is from the east side of the Jordanian valley and highlands and share close familial to Palestinians now in Jordan or in the West Bank.
Then you have the fact that the queen of Jordan is Palestinian and the crown prince is half Palestinian.
So I wouldn’t say Jordan doesn’t like Palestinians, more so some factions within the Jordanian government don’t like Palestinian political factions.
They are all Arabians and originate in Arabia 1000km south of Israel. Hashemite King of Jordan descends from Hashem from Mecca
Or maybe, it refers to the fact that the region is the western bank of the Jordan River. Crazy I know
this refutes anything how?
I mean if that's really all it was then you're sort of admitting that the Palestinians are so disconnected from the place they are claiming that they don't even have a real name for the area. Jews call it Judea and Samaria btw.
The name West Bank is derived from historical names of the region, Cisjordan, and Transjordan. Referring to this side of the River Jordan, and the other side of the River Jordan respectively. This is referring to what direction youre viewing the holy land from, and is referenced in the Hebrew Bible as: "Then you shall [be allowed to] return to your own land, and take possession of that which Moses the servant of the Lord gave you beyond the Jordan toward the sunrise.” Saying that cause they were looking from the east of the Jordan, towards the West, which is how the Arabic translation is. So in Latin this became Cisjordan, and Transjordan, in Arabic it would be West Bank and East Bank of the Jordan River. To say that West Bank isn't a proper name for the region when it refers to a literal part of the Tanakh is literally insane
First, the term “West Bank” originated after the 1948 Arab-Israeli war when Jordan took control of the territory and officially annexed it in 1950. The name refers to its geographical position on the western bank of the Jordan River, as opposed to Jordan’s “East Bank.” It was a Jordanian term, not a Palestinian one originally.
And Palestinians do not generally view Jordan as a “missing part” of Palestine in the way some might frame Northern Ireland with Ireland or North Korea with South Korea. The Palestinian national identity is centered on historic Palestine (what is now Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza), not Jordan.
Also despite conflicts between the Jordanian monarchy and the PLO, such as Black September, Jordanians and Palestinians are very close, they see each other as brothers, Jordan and Palestine are like the Australia and New Zealand of the Arab world lol.
The West Bank is a British term.
In the local indigenous language, the southern part is called Judea and the northern part is called Samaria.
Arab settlers ethnically cleansed the entire ancient Jewish population from Judea during the 1948 War. Jews in the West Bank predated Arab settlement by thousands of years.
Samaritan people still exist. They are the closest living relatives to Jewish people. They descend from four Northern Israelite tribes and they speak Samaritan Hebrew.
It was, when it was part of Ottoman Syria.
It’s more that Palestine during this time described a region, much like the “Levant” or the “Hejaz” and that present day Jordan was part of the region of Palestine. Politically Palestine during the Ottomans was part of Syria and later broken down into more independent sanjaks or provinces like Jerusalem.
Palestine as a state was not a thing until the 1960s, as after the Mandate and the war, Gaza was part of Egypt and the West Bank became part of Jordan.
Europeans called the area Palestine at that time. The actual rulers, the Ottomans the held the Western part of that is now Jordan as a portion of Ottoman Syria. The Eastern part of Jordan was part of Arabia.
The Text in the top is German and surprisingly easy to read. The orthography is also very similar to the orthography before the German orthography reform of 1996.
"CHARTE von PALAESTINA nach dem jetzigen Zustande desselben, größestentheils nach der Beschreibung des Hrn. D. Buschings im V. Theil seiner Erdbeschr. entworfen von Gottfr. Arn. Maas. 1769"
And, here's a Google translation of the original German: "Chart of Palestine as it currently stands, largely based on the description by Mr. D. Busching in Part V of his geographic description, drawn by Gottfr. Arn. Maas. 1769."
I can only imagine how cramped and achy Gottfr. Arn. Maas's hand must've been after drawing this!
All the rivers on the map are labeled”Nahar X”, “Nahar Y”
Nahar is the Hebrew word for River.
The more you know.
It's the arabic word for river
Neat. I love old maps.
Ah, Palaestina, the original Roman province name which name derived from the Greek and Egyption refer to the Philistine or Peleset and Hebrew Plishtim/Peleshet/ Palash
Al Quds, the Holy due to the site of 2 Jewish Temples
Sometimes it will say Bayt al-Maqdis, which is derived from the Hebrew Beit HaMikdash. The Holy Temple, ie The Jewish Temples.
The name of Nabolos or Nablus or Flavia Neapolis means new city of the emperor Flavius'.
1000+ years before was Shechem site of Joseph's tomb. "Way of the Patriarchs" trade route to Hebron. Cave of Machpelah or also known as Cave of the Patriarchs.
Didnt Hadrian literally rename it [something]-palestine to piss off the jews after the 3rd jewish war? Because the jews and philistines were enemies, so after Simons revolt in the early 100's Hadrian mocked them by renaming it palestine?
To me it doesnt matter what it was called or what it is called if we're relating this to todays conflict, it couldve been called Texas for 5000 years and id still want this bloodshed to end. But regarding history im not so sure the province was originally called palestine,
Yes, this was after the Bar Kokhba Revolt(132-136AD). Correct Simon bar Kokhba
Once Rome squashed the revolt they renamed from Judaea(orginally Yehuda/ Judea) to Syria Palaestina(yes for mocking and erasing Jewish heritage) reason for the name in the map. The
English Palestine.
Most Jews were exilled and taken as slave which significant increased the Jewish diaspora
I want all to live in the land side by side in safety and prosperity
Well I believe that there's an alternate theory that Palestine comes from Herodotus literally translating the word Israel into Greek. Israel literally translated to "one who wrestles with God" and Palesteis in Greek means wrestler. "ine/ina" comes from a common suffix for lands or countries.
First time I'm hearing it and it's definitely false. As a Hebrew speaker Israel is probably a meaningless name but according to the Hebrew Academy there is a theory suggests that Israel means struggle with god but not physically wrestling. The confusion may come from the way Ya'akov got the name Israel (after wrestling with an angel).
And btw nowdays it is acceptable in Hebrew to write Palestine as "פלסטין" with Samekh (ס) and Tet (ט) because these are the grammatical correct letters to write with while translating from a foreign language (as it came from German in Yiddish and Spanish in Ladino) but since the Bible and sometimes today it is written as "פלשתין" with Shin (ש) and Tav (ת) as it came from the word "פולשים" meaning invaders.
So Palestine definitely came from Hebrew. Didn't know that was even doubted.
PLSTn with the Samekh cognates with Peleset PLST. The Peleset were a name of one of the Sea Peoples who invaded Egypt during the Bronze Age collapse and the Philistines show up in the exact same area. So it sounds like it was a false friend, the Aegean tribal confederation in Gaza-Ashkelon had a name phonetically similar to the existing word for invader.
Its first appearance outside of a Sinaitic corpus and use as a land name is Herodotus, where it was used by the Greeks.
Bayt al-Maqdis, which is derived from the Hebrew Beit HaMikdash.
are you talking about the linguistics being derived? or about giving it the same name in Arabic?
But but but but it’s always been Palestine and the Palestinian people have been there since the time of dinosaurs /s an actual thing one of their leaders claimed despite ZERO archaeological or historical proof of there ever being a Palestine that existed between the Roman province (when it was actually Jewish JUDEA and the BRITISH MANDATE of palestine, and plo leaders literally publicly saying in the 60s and 70s they had completely made up a long term Palestinian identity out of people who had been Egyptian, Syrian and Jordanian for propaganda reasons. But arabs are brown, so they must be natives , right?!
LITERALLY did you miss the OP? What are you smoking?
Bayt Al Madis is an arabic name meaning the Holy City or House
Yeah, that’s what they’re saying. Bayit al-Maqdis, the holy house, Beit HaMikdash.
You both are right, many Arabic and Hebrew words mean the same. Just compare the numbers 1-10 in both languages, they are 50% the same. Ahhad = Wahhad, Eshtien = Ethnaien, and so one.
New Year in Hebrew is Rosh Hashanah, while in Arabic Ras as-Sana
Yeah Arabic and Hebrew are closely related languages so no wonder.
I used temple and house as interchange.
Beit means house as HaMikdash The Holy place or Temple or the sanctuary.
Also translate to The Holy House
All holy because of the Jewish Temples for both faiths.
Beit means 'house' in Hebrew.
HaMikdash means 'the holy' in Hebrew.
The Arabic sounds surprisingly similar, I wonder where they got it.
HaMikdash means 'the temple' not 'the holy'.
Basically, the name of the Jewish Temple that was built in that exact mountain.
The root K-D-Sh means sanctified/holy, so it's not really incorrect to say that "Beit Hamikdash" means "The House that is Holy".
Languages from all over the world often have similar words. Nothing new that 2 languages use a similar sounding word specifically when both are "sematic" groups of people..
Hebrews are not the only sematic people.. Arabs are sematic as well..
Arabic and Hebrew are both from the semetic language family, I don't think one got it from the other lol.
Arabic and Hebrew are both semetic languages lol I thought it was known they share the same roots
Kinda weird it sounds exactly like bayt hamikdash in heberew that predate Islam and Arabic by at least a thousand years. the exact same place where the Jewish temple stood has the same name Arabized. Interesting
Arabic and Hebrew share a lot of words in common due to both being semetic languages, not entirely sure about the second word but I'm confident Bayt/Beit has always been the word for "House" in Arabic as well as Phoenician.
Hebrew , Phoenician and Aramaic predate Arabic by a thousand years
Which derives from Beit Hamikdash בית המקדש which refers to the Jewish temples that were built there.
Muslims during Mohamed time used to pray toward Jerusalem before it was later changed during his times to Qaaba.
Maqdis means holy as well.
Also Hebrew and Arabic both have the same root language, so there are similar words.
Maybe because he plagiarised Judaism when he invented his new cult? Like claiming all the Jewish prophets
Angry downvotes
It's as if Arabs and Jews have ties to the land, common ancestors, similar languages and pray to the same god. This rivalry might be one of the most stupid in human history (not a history buff btw).
not a history buff btw
Understatement of the century
Nah people are just way too polarised and wouldn't even try to be a bit rational.
It's so insane how common misinformation in reddit is.. Al quds being derived from Hebrew is insane take
I find the name of the Dead Sea here interesting.
It appears to be named dead sea in German and Turkish.
But in Arabic, while we usually call it the Dead Sea too "Al-Bahr Al-Mayit", here it says "Bahr Loth" which seems to mean the Sea of Lot. This is a rarely used name.
In Christianity, the wife of Lot was turned into a pillar of salt. This probably is the source of that name. Islam does not have the "pillar of salt" part, referring instead to the destruction of Lot's city in general.
That is interesting thank you.
Not to be rude but to clarify Lot's wife is from Bereshit ('In the beginning')/ Book of Genesis. Yes part of Christianity but from the Hebrew Bible.
“Flee for your life! Do not look behind you, nor stop anywhere in the Plain; flee to the hills, lest you be swept away.”
"Hashem rained upon Sodom and Gomorrah sulfurous fire from Hashem out of heaven annihilating those cities and the entire Plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities and the vegetation of the ground. Lot’s wife looked back, and she thereupon turned into a pillar of salt"
https://www.sefaria.org/Genesis.19.17?lang=bi&aliyot=0
by christianity you are forgetting it is a jewish story but sure.
also, in hebrew its just called the salt sea
Not quite. It’s first labeled in German as “Der Salz See” = the Salt Lake. But also says “od. das Todte Meer” = “or the Dead Sea”
Nice, I like the dusty german expressions!
- Sir, shall I-
▪ Most controversial, Albert.
- But-
▪ I said most controversial.
Anyone wondering, Jerusalem is spelled "El-Kods" here
There is also "Ieruſalem" right above it
No, that’s the district name, which means “The Temple Mount”, in reference to the ancient Jewish temple. The city name is written there in smaller font, “Ierusalem”
Ancient Jewish temple huh? How'd that get there?
King David planned it, King Solomon built it, the Babylonians destroyed it, and here we all are thousands of years later still trying to sort all that out. Turns out Christians and Muslims really didn’t like the Israelites. It’s actually a really long story.
Yep like how the Israelites didn’t like the Canaanite and took over the land…
Israelites are Canaanites, and Hebrew is mutually intelligible with all other Canaanite languages. Jewish people are Canaanites who developed what people now call Judaism around the BC 1700s.
It’s not just some ancient temple, it’s the most holy site on all of Judaism. So holy that whenever Jews pray they pray towards it no matter where in the world they are, and they’ve been doing it for the past 2,000 years even though the temple itself is gone.
Ancient Muslims, before Makkah, prayed towards Jerusalem/Al-Quds as well
Yeah in Arabic its elkods
El Kods is the arabic name for Jerusalem
Because Jerusalem was founded by the Canaanites and named after one of their gods not any god of any current religion..
Jerusalem was originally named as Urusalim in ancient Egyptian texts. It's assumed it was named after the ancient Canaanite deity Shalem, the god of Dawn.. aka "City of Shalem".
The city origins had zero to do with any modern religion, not Christians, Muslims or Jews.. It was however the largest city in the area so all 3 groups tried to claim it as their own.. The city predates them all..
Not sure why this map is calling that whole area as el-kods but "Ieruſalem" is listed on the map not far away. Have to keep in mind each map maker will spell things in their own language which is why there are often many different spellings of a city name but no idea what El-Kods is.. Perhaps it means Al-Quds which is "Holy City" I believe in Arabic.
Also keep in mind just as today, anyone with the skills can produce a map..
edit...
Look at the down votes by people who hate history. It's not even like anything I posted isn't easily available information.. lol I guess the same type of people who don't believe in Dinosaurs..
I mean, it does have unarguable significance to both Jews and Christians. Jerusalem's temple was the cultic center of Judaism and was established as such (mythically) by King Solomon, but definitively by King Josiah (who lived in 600 BC). From that point on, the only place where sacrifices could take place was at the temple in Jerusalem. As such, it developed a central place in Jewish religion (and Jews still mourn its destruction and fast on the day it was destroyed - the 9th of Av).
Due to its centrality in Judaism, it should be no surprise it became important in Christianity. Much of the gospels takes place in and around Jerusalem, including the passion narrative itself.
The exact same argument is valid for Islam, the third of the Abrahamic religions.
Eh... Both zionists and jihadis both need thrown into that river and/or sea they're always on about. Give the region back to the Canaanites (who I guess would be Assyrians now?) Anyways jeruselam was best when Babylon burned it.
Loved your post - gave it an upvote because of historical accuracy.
It's funny to me because Jerusalem predates even the Jews in the lands, yet Arabs think Al-Quds is correct.
Well, it probably comes from Hebrew in any case.
The name may have been shortened from مَـدِيـنَـة الْـقُـدْس Madīnat al-Quds, a calque of the Hebrew name for the city, Ir HaKodesh (עיר הקודש "the Holy City" or "City of the Holy Place").
Every single Reddit forum, people are forcing Israel/palestine discussion. Give it a rest already. Plenty of boards to argue about this stuff, no need to constantly AstroTurf
This is MapPorn. And this is an awesome map that many people have not seen before. Lots of interesting and historical detail. This is an appropriate place to post this map. The fact that it is a map of a controversial place is irrelevant. Maps of controversial places are often posted here. It's a cool map.
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Nah. It’s astroturfed by Indonesians and Pakistanis who see it as their sort of cyber jihad. Nonstop.
Yeah it’s not like there are a lot of people in the west who seemingly care about this stuff
The Ottoman Empire did have some great cartographers.
It did, but this seems to be a German map, not an Ottoman map.
The fucking Piri Ries map keeps me up at night
Why are old maps mostly always in German?
They aren't. The number of German maps is far smaller than the number of Latin maps of a similar period.
Because German was the only language at 1700s
All other languages were invented later
This makes total sense thank you for the explanation.
Qapla!
German was the primary language of science for very large parts of Europe before English surpassed it. The bourgeoisie and academia in most (modern) European countries used to have a sizeable German presence.
None of my grandparents speak a word of English but all speak fluent German. Finland here.
Since when?
It must be swiss german tho. Karte is written Charte.
Depends. If it's the 1600s they're mostly Dutch.
Bring back Acre and Tyre!!!
Could the map makers not think of calling these areas District like 20 times lol
Interesting that the icon (image) for Jerusalem is a church, not the dome of the rock mosque. German map, I guess.
Dome of the rock is not a mosque, it’s a shrine
He probably meant the Al-Aqsa masjid, which many people confuse with the Dome of the Rock in the broader Al-Aqsa compound.
It is a masjid. I've prayed in it several times.
I didn't care about it then...
So the two state solution is already in place the whole eastern part of this map is now Jordan. Next thing a noticed the Druz had a much larger part of the country.
Like half of Jordan included in Palestine, but people still trying to convince me that the arbitrary borders drawn by the french and british actually belonged to an ancient palestinian nation.
No, people are arguing that the lands where arbitrary borders were drawn by the British and the French (and the Dutch, Belgians, Germans, etc) belonged to their inhabitants. There were plenty of places where colonies bore entirely new names not connected to any previous name for the region, but those places still belonged to their inhabitants just as much. I can guarantee you that before colonization there was no ancient central african national identity, but the lands of the Central African Republic still belonged to its inhabitants regardless.
At the end of the day the British drew their border the way that they did, and they called one of the colonies Palestine, and so we call the people who lived there the Palestinians, and the land that they lived on was as much their homeland, and it belonged to them just as much as the homelands of any other colonized people belonged to those people.
Ok, so we agree that the current borders of Palestine were a colonial construct.
what really matters is that the people live there and have rights, correct ?
Then why does it matter if it’s 1 state or 2 ? Why they have no right to divide Palestine in 1948 but had right to divive it 30 years before ?
People really need to stop living in the past. The whole "we were here first" thing just goes in circles. Greeks were in Istanbul(Byzantium) before the Turks, and before that it was the Thracians, who even knows where they ended up. The Franks didn’t start out in France, and the English aren’t originally from England either. History’s full of migrations and takeovers. What matters now is the current reality. Focus on the present, keep the peace, and stop the fighting, on all sides.
It sounds nice in theory but is pragmatically much more difficult, especially in a continuous conflict that has never been settled (where different injustices continue to build up and people want justice for current injustices, not just historical ones before their existence).
Achieving "peace" and ending fighting requires an agreement that both sides can move forward with and see "better" than fighting. For some, an uneasy conflict is preferred to an unjust peace but what constitutes justice and is sufficient for peace changes across societies as they have different value systems, subjective experiences, etc.
What both sides and their supporters think should be required to obtain peace are widely variable and there is no "objective" answer to this.
It is very easy to say everyone just put down their weapons and stop fighting in Israel/Palestine and just accept the borders as they are now but that doesn't even answer what happens in the West Bank?
The reality is the conflict has a lot of messy problems to settle that both sides can not agree on, then you add international players into the mix that fuel the problems and getting peace in current reality is very difficult - even if you just "focus on the present".
With almost any solution to such conflicts, peace takes both sides having leadership that risk their own necks to take steps to bind to unpopular solutions in exchange (mutually both sides) for peace but that type of leadership is not getting power on either end of the conflict.
And in fact, both sides are being pushed by forces both domestically and internationally that suggest they shouldn't make any sacrafices and expect the otherside to make all concessions if peace is to be obtained and under those conditions (especially in the conflict we are talking about here), it isn't going to happen.
How many people would like to hear that Palestinian leadership likely needs to make concessions to achieve peace (no Hamas, no infinite right of return, no more bounties, whatever) given the historical context?
How many people want to hear that Israel likely needs to and should be giving up some settlements in the West Bank and ensuring that Palestine is given self-determination with a contiguous state after October 7?
Not many on either end...
Because Humans love nationalism ig, I mean by that logic why don't we just take down all of the world's borders?
The problem was not dividing it, several colonies were divided (for example the regions of British Cameroons each voted on becoming part of either Nigeria or Cameroon when British rule ended, without anyone having complained about the outcome that I know of). Had there been no Jewish colonisation during 25 years of British rule and Palestine had been made independent as two pieces, each democratically ruled by the Palestinians of that part of the country, instead of one then I doubt anyone would have cared much. People care because the partition was a tool to continue the colonization started under the British. The only reason partition was proposed was to placate those Jewish colonists who resorted to violence after the British announced they would be introducing majority rule to the colony. The extremeness of its gerrymandering (slicing the proposed state left to the Palestinians into 4 seperate pieces) shows that it had no other goal than to impose the rule of the Jewish colonists on as much of Palestine as possible, leaving large part of the Palestinian population under continued colonial rule against the democratic will of the Palestinians.
By what basis do you characterize Jewish migration to the area as colonization. They simply wished to move back to the area where they were from.
When Mexicans move to California are they trying to colonize it?
They generally aren't trying to establish a Mexican ethnostate with a perpetually gerrymandered ethnic composition, then institute a regime of ethnic supremacy and marginalise, expel and illegally exclude most of the existing inhabitants of the wrong ethnic group. Were they to do so I assure that most sane people would describe their behaviour as colonism.
A lily-white European from Brooklyn or Warsaw, who can produce no evidence that a single identifiable ancestor ever so much as set foot in West Asia is not "from" Israel-Palestine just because they claim that some of their ancestors once lived there millennia ago.
That is a ludicrous basis on which to assign superior territorial rights - superior rights that are not accepted on the same extra-territorial basis where any other ethnic group on Planet Earth is concerned. For example Joe Biden does not have the automatic right to live in Ireland simply because some of his ancestors once lived there and he is of the "right" ethnicity, while someone born in Dublin of Nigerian parents is denied that same right simply because they are of the "wrong" ethnicity.
In fact thanks to the Good Friday Agreement this same individual of Nigerian descent would have more right to claim Irish citizenship & live in Ireland than Biden or any of the so-called Irish Americans parading on St. Patrick's Day, even if said Nigerian-descended indivdual was born in Belfast, Northern Ireland - which is actually part of the UK.
It is a meaningless claim in any case. The sort of human lineage purity Zionists rely on is a myth. We now know beyond doubt that the human race is so staggeringly interrelated that everyone alive today has exactly the same set of ancestors from a far more recent point in time than most of us realise - the lower-bound estimate of the human Identical Ancestors Point is only around 3,000 BC.
Therefore EVERYBODY is descended from the Jews of Ancient Israel & Judah, along with every non-Jew who lived on Planet Earth at the time whose line survives. Every Hamas fighter has Jewish ancestors and every rabid Zionist has ancestors from the ancient people of the Arabian peninsula. If you and President Xi Jiaoping of China took a time machine back 5,000 years to ancient Jerusalem the very first ancient Jew you met would be the ancestor of both of you. The same thing would be true if you travelled to any part of the world of 3,000 BC and met anyone living there.
It is scientifically & historically absurd for anyone to claim, "we are Jews. Our "ancestral homeland is over here. You are not Jews. Your "ancestral homeland" is over there". It is racist nonsense. In a very real sense we are all one closely-related lhuman race - as far back as the time of the Israelite Kingdoms we all come from everywhere and Planet Earth is our "ancestral homeland".
Ethnic nationalism is racism, built on lies.
"Humans Are All More Closely Related Than We Commonly Think".
On their own description? Everyone called it that at the time.
When Mexicans move to California are they trying to colonize it?
No. Compare and contrast the two movements and see if you can work out what "colonisation" means (also look at Jewish immigration before the British and you might notice some key differences...)
Not a colony. Land won fighting the Ottoman Turks in WWI.
I be they named it something akin to a UN mandate.
Nobody is saying that. What they are saying is that the people who live in those arbitrarily drawn areas have lived there for generations regardless of what it was called and its ethnic cleansing to forcibly remove them.
No shock the Sexpestiny fan is spreading lies and misinformation.
Oh, so nobody is posting stuff like "It was always Palestine", when it's always ?
Stop being a smartass. You could call them Palestinians/Arabs/Hebrews whatever you guys want. The fact is that this land has been settled by these people for generations.
Which lands ? the dessert ? Was Tel Aviv (not Jaffa), but the parcel of land that became Tel Aviv in 1947 inhabited by palestinians ? why do they claim they have the right to it if they never inhabited there?
By that ludicrous rationale it would be entirely reasonable for Mexicans to enter the United States en masse against the will of the existing inhabitants, establish new settlements in the large uninhabited areas of the country and then demand that more than half of the continental United States be given to them for the establishment of an ethnostate, with the existing non- Mexican inhabitants living on its proposed territory expelled in order to artificially maintain Mexican ethnic supremacy.
If, hypothetically, the current government of the U.S. decided to open its borders and grant all Mexicans citizenship, and then, after 30 years, chose to revoke that citizenship and attempt to expel them into the sea, I would find it reasonable for those affected to demand independence to protect themselves from the oppression.
Furthermore, if there are individuals who, not because of their ethnic background but because they chose to side with the genocidal Americans, I believe it would be reasonable to relocate them for security reason, with economic compensation, as they pose an existential threat to the people residing there.
They did inhabit there. The entire area was inhabited.
My fiancé’s dad showed me the paper documents he had showing ownership for land in Haifa lol but he’s a filthy pali arab
Well the Arabs colonised it so..
Guess that means white people in the US should be round up and exterminated. After all, they colonized the continent. Or does that logic only apply if you’re using it to justify the genocide of Arabs?
This is other than the fact that the Palestinian people were Arabized…. Not ethnically cleansed.
I’m fully Lebanese and my test showed I’m 90% Levantine with the remaining 10% being Arab, Italian, Anatolian and Jewish.
Hmm that’s called attacking a straw man pal…
You just assumed my position and started arguing against it.
My argument is against the whole “blood and soil”, which would also be anti-Zionist
Why an Arab in Haifa can claim ownership in Tel Aviv ? why not claim ownership of a Place in ME instead of a recently created colonial construct ?
Hasan fan try not to bring up destiny challenge
Belong to the modern Jewish people*, not an ancient Palestinian nation.
This map is so hard to read
All these old maps mentioning Palestine are always from Europe, why is this?
1769: Muhammad Ali Pasha born. Major escalation in The War of the Bar Confederation.
Respect for drawing the same trees and hills
Thanks! I thought the name only dated back to the 19th century but it existed even longer!
the name existed since the roman empire took over the lande and renamed it after the philistines.
But it wasn't in use for more than a thousand years during the Crusader, Mameluke and Ottoman occupations.
Modern Palestine was created by the British in 1920 from Ottoman Syria.
The Romans called the province “Syria Palaestina” after the Bar Kochba revolt in 135 AD in an attempt to blur the Jewish identity of the region.
Anyone arguing with such maps should make it clear that this is about historical, geographical and non-state classifications. Anything else is a distortion of history. And: Maps have always been political tools, so always treat them with skepticism
Stolen Jewish lands
Why stolen? They massacred the Roman Defence Forces and roman settlers and then they were relocated for security reasons (which had even happened more frequently before).
Wow, history class just got a whole lot cooler!
I love old maps and this looks good
beautiful map
Oben steht einfach das lan der drussen israel dürfte nie und hatte nie das Recht sich dort eine Regierung und mit Grenzen zu bilden nirgends steht israel
My village was too tiny to appear on the map haha
So Jordan is Palestine when are the Palestinians going to Rocket them? Or is it different for them as they are not Hebrews?
Make Palestine 1769 again
I see region named Hebron in the bottom? Is that where my sunshine Lebron is from??? He from the holy land holy shit.
But apparently it was all barren land for appropriation
Damn why would they make a detailed map of an empty land ?
Israel was never empty, just occupied by Greeks, Romans, Arabians and Turks for period of history until the indigenous Israelites liberated their homeland.
Polish people aren’t indigenous
If you ask the poles they’d tell you these people don’t originate from here, they are originally from Israel in the holy land.
It was never Israel
Always was, is now, and always will be
Look at all the pro Israeli bots being on top with every irrelevant link ups ever.
Palestine never existed /s
Israel*
It was palestine at that time, a region in the ottman empire (different thing than the modern definition)
Fuck being the guy that had to draw the same tiny little hill 1000 times
I imagine they were paid a lot for their work, accurate maps were very important
I don't think so, if this video is correct
https://youtu.be/yTyX_EJQOIU?feature=shared
Not had much from Map Men lately have we :(
This wasn't an accurate map because in 1769 that was Ottoman Syria.
Palestine was eliminated as a Roman colony between the Crusader, Mameluke and Ottoman occupations. There was no administrative district called Palestine until the British created it in 1920.
Is it your belief that each of those maps onto a specific hill in a specific place?
It's 2025. I dream of getting a job where I draw 1000 little hills on a map.
The machines took everything from us
did they not have stamps or other printing methods back then?
Half of people agree with you, half of people want that job more than anything.
It's actually quite a meditative state
I just imagine it’s like Fallout 76 where the mountains on the map don’t even closely line up in the real world.
What else are you going to do to pass the time in 1769?
You could probably just do it with a stamp
Ya but they’re not all really in the right place. And where there are hills he didn’t really put any. Kinda half hazard
He was paid per hill