copium overdose but I sure hope it's 2025
bro just install linux on ur desktop
then it's a linux desktop
i will, i'm planning to go from Windows 10 to Linux Mint around the end of support of W10. but i hope it's the "year of linux desktop" because it would mean that big company like Nvidia and big videogame studio finally have a reason to actively make their product linux compatible without having to rely on Proton to "conquer that new market" wich mean a lot less trouble to have a smooth experience.
What's wrong with proton? It's like the main reason why year of Linux desktop even has a shot
nothing wrong but the less layers between a program and the machine the better the performance, it would also mean a lot less configurations
My understanding is that proton even improves the performance of some games, because it's not like a virtual machine running on top of Linux. Instead it just translates Windows runtime API calls to corresponding Linux ones which, because Linux is better architected in many ways, ends up actually improving performance.
Please correct me if I got any details wrong.
Proton doesn't improve the performance. The lack of overhead caused by Windows garbage improves the performance (in some cases).
Depends on how you measure I guess. Improve when compared to vm, improve compared to windows, improve compared to running an unoptimized Linux build?
Sounds like @themoosh is comparing it to running in a VM while you're comparing it to running on the system it was built targeting?
I guess on a second read, it does sound like that's what they were comparing it to. You're right, I was comparing it to Windows native.
That's about right. Proton can yield better performance than Windows. But a native Linux build would very likely run even faster than Proton.
Less layers in Windows are compensated by more layers of AI spyware bloat.
that's why i'm leaving windows in the first place
Most games perform equally well under proton, some even perform better than Windows.
Proton is a reimplementation of windows, in most cases it doesn't have more layers.
What if Valve decides there's no new Steam Deck and in 3-4 years Proton development stops? Obviously it wouldn't completely stop, but it would slow down significantly and without native games we would be out of luck for new releases
3-4 years with one Linux distro is a long time! I'd be itching to change well before then.
I mean, the desktop experience becomes kinda ephemeral at that point, and setting things up again is like having a spring clean. For important stuff you could save-out your dot files, sync your home dir to the cloud or containerise.
Thats... not what 99.9% of people want. Long term stability is important, otherwise there won't be a big adoption
The desktop experience should be ephemeral. If you have to think about your OS, then it's a bad OS.
Under what scenario would that happen though? If Linux doesn't ever get big enough, then games aren't going to release Linux native versions (because why would they, out of the goodness of their hearts)?
If Linux does take off, then I don't see Valve ever stopping proton.
Nvidia's drivers work just fine on Linux, they aren't open source but they do work well.
*As long as you don't have a laptop with hybrid integrated/dedicated graphics
**As long as you use driver 555 or newer if using Wayland
Why Mint?
because after some research it look the easiest for my usage (gaming and programming). it's ubuntu based so there is a lot of support and help on forums, UI is a lot like windows and i've been told that it's lighter and easier than ubuntu... (i'm open for other proposition tho, i'm still trying distro on VirtualBox ATM)
When it comes to Linux you're going to get a lot of people hyping up their favorite flavor of it. If you've looked into and tried different distros on VMs and settled on Mint, that's a fine choice. As you said, it has good support, it has a graphical setup process, and it looks like Windows right out of the box, though depending on the desktop environment you want to use you can make any linux distro look like Windows.
I use Mint on my work laptop, because it was easy to set up and I don't tinker on it much. I use Arch on my main PC because I like to customize and tweak it. I wanted to try something that felt different from Windows, and decided to try out Hyprland, which I've been enjoying a lot. I like to learn and try new things, and I missed the olden days of Windows where I could fuck around with system files if I wanted to, optimize boot times, etc.
It will always come down to how much you want to experiment and how much you want to customize your environment. Not everyone wants to mess around with their OS, which is why even immutable distros like Bazzite can carve out a decent chunk of the user base for themselves.
At the end of the day, your OS is a means to a specific end that only you know. Don't go with what's trendy or what seems "challenging" just for the sake of it being challenging, just go with what fits your needs. The whole appeal of Linux in the first place is that you get to decide for yourself how your desktop experience should be.
i'm pretty sure i'm gonna settle for Mint but earing other people's experience, especialy people that have gone through multiple distro is always a plus
don't fall for the debianaganda
If you use debian (and ubuntu) based distros like mint you not only have to deal with old software that's obnoxious to develop with and your drivers will be outdated.
You also get stuck with old software and experience bugs that were fixed years ago, for example some debian versions still ship pulseaudio despite it being abandoned in favor of pipewire which solves many problems.
They also still don't support wayland on mint so multi monitor support is broken in many ways and there's no hdr support.
and so what distro fix that?
Basically any that aren't debian based. Fedora derivatives like nobara for example.
The driver thing is legit, but it's a tradeoff. The older your software and firmware is, the more stable your system is. I used Tumbleweed for a while so I could have the bleeding edge GPU drivers for gaming. I would occasionally have issues where a package would update, and all the text in the whole computer would be invisible. And I just had to wait a day or two for a fix. I even had one where I had to reinstall the OS completely, but I never actually determined what the root cause of that was. After that, I moved to Slowroll, which delays updates by up to a month for stability.
If you are gaming and use Wayland as your display server, just make sure you have Nvidia driver 555 or newer. That fixes an issue with the screen flickering when going into full screen games.
KDE Plasma is closer to Windows look and feel IMO.
can be easily installed in any distros.
i'll give it a shot 👍
For the record, KDE isn't a distro. It's a desktop environment.
In Linux, the UI is more-or-less completely disconnected from what distro you use. You can install any desktop environment on any distro and it will work. You might need to tweak some configs to get things the way you want (similar to how someone might in Windows).
Whenever you feel comfortable, I strongly recommend checking out a list and seeing how different window managers feel. The ability to completely swap out the UI IS one of the reasons I'll never be going back to Windows. Once you start exploring you discover features you never knew were even an option.
I've personally discovered I love super light-weight window managers that I can control completely with my keyboard.
Here's a good starting point.
I love Plasma. It's the Windows desktop that I always wanted. It has so much customizability.
After years of trying different distros I ended up on Debian and never looked back... Most stable for me.
do you play videogames? and if yes do you have any troubles? because i have no doubt i'll be able to code on any linux but i also play a lot
Lutris still exists, and so does Proton. Additionally, you can always keep the dual boot option. There is nothing magical about Mint; whatever works on Mint will work on other distros, as well.
The main reason I stay on Debian is that their upgrades never bricked my system like it happened to me when updating OpenSUSE (their newer version stopped supporting my old computer), and there was no downgrade in quality (like between Mandriva 2008 and Mandriva 2008 Spring)
i know they exist but does they run smoothly? how much time will i have to spent on configuration? i know you can do anything on linux but the time and knowledge required are important to me because i have some friends that want to go to linux too and they are a lot less technical than me
Proton runs default on SteamOS and it seems to run most Steam games fine.
I switched from Windows to manjaro in February of this year and the gaming experience is incredible. I remember proton being good a few years ago but it's seemingly perfect now. I have zero issues with new releases! Everything works so well I don't even check proton db for compatibility these days. I played monster hunter wilds and crashed twice in the entire campaign, only during cutscenes for some reason. I actually ended up having a more stable experience than all of my windows friends lol.
I have an AMD CPU and GPU which I'm sure helps. Not sure where manjaro ranks for the gaming distros but I chose it for being based on arch hoping that would improve compatibility with steam/proton since steamos is also arch based. I don't know if there's any validity to that but it's worked out very well so far.
Last note - look for games you play in proton db. Look at the user reviews there to see what hardware they have, what Linux distro they use, and how much trouble they had, if any, getting the game to run. The biggest issue will be games like valorant or genshin that rely on client side rootkits for anti cheat. They work on Linux if the developer allows them to, but if it's a game that decides not to then there's no workaround for your pure Linux system. It was no issue for me, but check proton before you commit!
Although if steamos gets enough market share, those games may be tempted to change their mind and maybe work with valve to make steamos the 1 distro they support with anti cheat :)
It's 2025 the light/heavy thing only matters if you are running it on a potato.
This kind of attitude is why software performance is going to shit. "The hardware will make up the difference" is just an excuse to be lazy and it's why things like web apps aren't meeting their full potential.
That's 3 months away. It already is around the end of support of Windows 10. If you're going to do it, why wait?
i'm trying differents distro on virtual box, i'm looking for equivalent of some software i use that are windows only and i have a shitton of file to move but mostly i want to be extra sure i don't forget anything on my old install before the new one so i continue using it and ask myself for each action if i'll be able to do that on mint without too much efforts: modern videogame, printer compatibility, LED configuration on my keyboard and mouse, clipboard history, miscelaneous drivers like wifi, etc... i want to preshot as much trouble as possible before moving
So not really serious then.
what do you mean?
They are just acting like an elitist Linux user. Just ignore them.
Linux has fundamental limitations like the lack of a stable C ABI that make it literally impossible to release a closed-source binary (like a video game) that is playable for more than a few years and on different distros. The reality is Win32 (via Wine/Proton) is the only real game development platform on Windows, here's a good article on the subject: https://sporks.space/2022/02/27/win32-is-the-stable-linux-userland-abi-and-the-consequences/
Flatpak and appimage have entered the chat.
appimage and Flatpak still have dependencies they don't like to talk about.
My 3D printer was broken by an OS update that changed the networking stack and the new one doesn't support CANBUS in the way the application expects.
Even in the same distribution Linux isn't the same Linux over time.
That sounds like a kernel module problem, which is a problem that there's no real solution to without virtualisation. Anything that needs to talk to specialist hardware is at risk.
And that's another issue, there is not single exe, there's multiple different formats and versions
An appimage is an appimage. You double click to run it and it runs. No installation needed.
Yeah the article mentions all of them, wake me up when that's the default way to ship applications in Linux. While the system is so fractured it's not a realistic build environment to target
They aren't the default, but they are viable solutions.
What's native Linux program and/or installer that works on any distro?
Appinage only requires libfuse. Flatpak is widely shipped, and can be installed on almost any distro that doesn't ship it by default.
I ran Kububtu for the last two years at work, as a desktop. It was our standard environment. I was not a Dev.
Linux is not ready for the desktop.
My sentiment too. I've ran linux for webdev for the last 15 years, but the general desktop experience just isn't as stable as Windows sadly
You know what... I've been thinking about this *a lot* lately. I haven't earlier because I've had so many bad experiences with Linux. There's a lot to list, and I don't think this post is appropriate place for it, but it's been a lot.
But lately? Microsoft is in a spiral when it comes to windows, and it's the kind of spiral you see before you wash your hands. The fact that they've been showing candy crush in the start menu (I HAVE FUCKING WINDOWS 11 PROFESSIONAL EDITION HOW DARE YOU) and that it's just gotten slower and slower and slower, and worse and worse and worse.
The indexing service was replaced with trash. The start menu has a fucking React component whose only use case is to show web content in the start menu.
I don't want web ANYTHING in the start menu. I don't want to to search fucking Bing. I want a better indexing service and NO INTERNET SHIT in the start menu. The start menu is for accessing software on my machine. I do not want to use it to search the internet for anything.
I want a better indexing service and NO INTERNET SHIT in the start menu
the internet is the future, my guy, soon it'll be everywhere
the internet is the future, my guy, soon it'll be everywhere
Sure, but it can fuck right off until I open my web browser and search it.
Don't put Internet services in the OS start bar.
Won't be
Sure bro, just don't expect the printer to work and you can't change the download folder of your browser to the other drive and changing the kb input language is buggy and the interface is different from anything you're already comfortable with just because.
Also, 50 percent chance the Linux install hangs on your setup with no reason given.
And the best part is that someone will always be along to tell you how not only does that not happen, but that it can't happen, and even if it could have happened, it's the hardware vendor's fault for not respecting the SweetFA kernel flag added in 5.4.pi, with the subtle (or not-so-subtle) implication that you've somehow made up or even created this problem specifically in order to make Linux look bad and drive people away from OSS projects, all without ever at any point offering actual advice on how to work around the issue.
And I say that as someone who uses and maintains Linux both at work and at home.
I know man, I used to write shell scripts for my IT job and it still took me a couple hours to troubleshoot a failing Linux install. Usability just doesn't seem to be high on their list of priorities. Linux for servers is rock solid though, I'll give them that.
In a way, it's a "product" and an attitude from a different era. Early on, Linux distros and (to varying degrees) the other open source POSIX/UNIX-y operating systems got into a strange kind of one-upsmanship where the more closely you adhered to published specs, the cooler you were, and if it didn't work on your hardware, well... "talk to your garbage vendor, because our implementation is perfect." would not be an unrealistic IRC or usenet response from major maintainer. Hell, even today.
It was software as art and elegance, and that's all very admirable in principle, of course, but along with the ability to sneer because you understood vendor hardware better than they did, it endowed the early development culture with a sense of elitism on top of whatever inherent elitism most IT people develop (and hopefully abandon) at some point in their career. As Linux popularized and the usual arrays of hacks and workarounds came into play, this turned into a sort of collective resentment, a sense that the "unwashed masses" were encroaching on a beautiful work. Compare the September That Never Ended and AOL's early attempts to join EFnet and you'll see tech culture is always suspicious of outsiders, often with reason.
I don't think that never entirely went away, and instead just degraded into the "user-is-probably-an-idiot-with-bad-hardware"-first approach we all know and.. know.
The saddest thing is, that things seem to get worse, instead of better.
There was a time when Windows were slow and convoluted and Linux lighting fast and reliable. Things like Compiz allowed some sci-fi UI features, while everything else just worked out-of-the-box (with exception of .mp3 codecs)
Every year is the year of the Linux desktop if you believe hard enough
Every year is the year of the Linux desktop… just not this one
Next year is the year of linux on the desktop.
"Bro I told you not to switch universes during time travel"
Nah, 2012 was the year of Ubuntu.
Different year for different people.
I mean, I can't do more than tell you that chocolate mousse is awesome. If you want to make fun of me for coping and declaring the "year of chocolate mousse" while you smugly keep eating gravel, that's your decision.
Seriously, this is a programming sub and people are somehow having trouble with linux in this day and age, where shit is basically plug and play?
Must not be many fullstacks in here, since nearly all servers are running on linux.
Except you're not getting chocolate mousse are you? You're getting chocolate, eggs, sugar and cream. And then when you ask how to make it you get hit with a "lmao rtfr idiot" while they berate you for wanting to Uber one from the shops because BigCorptm bad.
Or, y'know, you get a box of EasyMix and told that it doesn't include any hidden pebbles. and then it just works.
It's the year Virtual Reality finally started getting good.
So… 2058 then?
But isn’t this whole bungling of windows 11 actually give this more validity than ever? My gaming PC literally can’t install windows 11, I’m not the only one.
No, that's something I have heard for every new Windows version
It's steam and gaming which pushes Linux a lot. The percentage stayed the same around 1% for a lot of years, but now increased to 2,5% thanks to Steam in the last years
However, even with the current increase it will take many many more years
(Edited percentage)
How much of that increase is just from the Steam Deck?
I checked the percentages and corrected the numbers
According to Steam, Arch is the most famous one and about 0,3%. It is also the base of Steam Deck if I am informed correctly
Currently Steam is at 2.5%, without (Arch/ Steam Deck) makes it 2,2%
While it was below 1% for all the previous years
Wow, that's a lot bigger than I expected... If Linux can get 5-10% market share in the coming years, that would represent a pretty huge market for developers. Platforms like steamOS could break the chicken and the egg problem of developers and users. Exciting stuff
Won't happen.
Will happen
It's the year of the Linux desktop finally
And next year as well
And year after that
But seriously, as long it's growing I would really call it "the year of the Linux desktop"
That's not what they're saying. They're saying the Windows 11 installation requirement for a TPM chip disqualifies roughly half of all laptop and desktop computers currently in use*.
If half of all computers can't install the new version of Windows, what else will they do? Buy a new computer? Likely yes, likely stay on Win 10 in large enough numbers to force Microsoft to revert their decision to end security updates, but it's enough for Linux-curious users to move on.
* citation needed, I read this in an article but don't know which one
Edit: All I did was explain what they meant.
Legitime answer
People used Windows XP a lot longer without security updates, so I doubt many people will switch
The WinXP userbase after EOL was not anywhere close to 50%. I doubt it was a double digit percentage.
Microsoft is going to have to revert their decision to not maintain security updates. They're already feeling pressure from corporate clients and agreed to security updates for servers and business licenses. They'll fold to the consumer market if enough people stay on Windows 10.
No. Windows 11 is still the vastly dominant platform and it's not even close.
Beyond that, gamers don't seem to realize Microsoft makes most of its money from business deployments
Most people can't install Windows 11 simply because their hard disk uses MBR instead of GPT, the Windows 11 installer gives the wrong error message.
Windows 11 is already 5 years old it supports CPU's from 2017 so 8 years old.
People crying that their 8+ year old hardware don't work lol.
But isn’t this whole bungling of windows 11 actually give this more validity than ever?
Windows 11 doing what ever doesn't change the majority reason end users cannot use linux: it straight up doesn't work for their workloads.
Bit of chicken and egg situation, yes. But it is what it is.
My gaming PC literally can’t install windows 11
The only requirement a 'gaming' might not have, is TPM if its super old, which you don't actually need to have to install windows 11.
Your point on 1 is interesting. My entire 12 year steam library appears to be playable on my Linux machine.
My entire 12 year steam library appears to be playable on my Linux machine.
Now, having limited gaming options might not affect you personally. But despite the huge improvements thanks to Valve, for the vast majority of gamers, Linux is a non-starter still.
Unfortunately the reason the nerds love Linux is the same reason there will never be a Linux revolution without a big directional shift, even with Microsoft pushing it along. Linux and its distributions geared for normal use is still like 93 different OS beta branches built in 2003 that stayed in 2007, and Windows is like an OS built in 2000 and does its makeup every 10 years, and windows 11 is a botch job. Even with the botch job everything looks nice, but nothing underneath has been solved and actually got worse
The one thing Linux has going for it aside from the usual spyware Windows things in my dual boot config is that since installing a local W11, it introduced this new bewildering bug where videos on my second monitor are laggy. So every time I want to watch a series or a movie, I switch to Mint, which(theres a catch since its Linux) doesnt support FHD streaming playback on any browser assumedly because of Widevine, so you literally have to go out of your way to sail seas which is hilarious.
doesnt support FHD playback on any browser
WTF
I guess he is talking about the streaming platforms and it is due to drm. This is not the fault of Linux distributions. Drm is a shitty way to gatekeep content.
After randomly getting the same certificate issue with streaming that I used to get years ago on Firefox and Chrome on Linux that took me over an hour to fix just to break a month later, I decided to try Microsoft Edge (installed for Xbox cloud streaming), and it just worked. This was on my Steam Deck with a 800p screen so I don't know about the FHD support on Edge.
Windows 11 might have new bugs, but Linux gets issues popping up from more than 10 years ago that the average user isn't going to to sit there and try to fix it.
if the community is as elitist and gatekeeping as stackoverflow I can assure you no year would be the year of Linux. the average user don't want to rice their archlinux nor bothered with difference between gnome, kde, xfce, etc. they want seamless integration with their current usecase out of the box.
They are not though. The real reason it's not the year is most software runs like shit on linux. (and no, nobody wants to learn a new alternative program).
"Most" software runs equally fine or better on Linux. It's competitive games (with their invasive anti cheats) and some crucial productivity software (MS Office, Photoshop, etc.) that won't run well. That's enough to keep Linux from being useable for a large portion of people, true. But it's straight up misinformation to imply that most software runs like shit.
I'm a Linux newbie, and 99% of the time I can't tell that I'm even running Linux vs something like Windows 7. And now I no longer have to constantly disable AI "features", OneDrive, and copies MS spyware after every system update.
You can keep sniffing on the copium but the general reception of Linux is the evidence if most software runs fine or not.
I use it as my daily driver. I would know if most software runs like shit. It does not.
And LOL at "general reception" having anything to do with how software runs on Linux. The general public uses whatever comes with their computer.
Linux isn't ready for mass adoption yet, I agree with that. But you are weirdly anti-Linux for some reason even though you don't sound like you have a clue what you're talking about.
Bro, basically all productivity software, game engine and any semi decent graphic software is dogwater on linux, random crashes, UI glitches everywhere...
I play games on Linux every day. Just not competitive multiplayer ones (weren't my thing to begin with). All of my games run within ~2% performance of my windows installation on the same machine. Some games better, some games worse.
Linux isn't going to work for anyone playing League of Legends or whatever the latest hot pro game is, though.
I'm not talking about games. I'm talking about professional work that doesn't involve a CLI.
I covered crucial productivity software in my first post, so not sure why you think that's a gotcha? I had already made the point that Linux isn't going to work for a substantial portion of people for that reason.
And the fact that you think productivity software on Linux still has to involve a CLI tells me you have no idea what you're talking about. Like you made up your mind 20 years ago and then turned your brain off.
MS Office
My current job requires it, but I've done everything with the browser versions so far without problems
The major deal is that most systems works like this:
Windows 95, 98, 98SE, 2000... then 7, 8, 10, 11
MacOS X, 10.11, 10.12.... then comes 11, 12, then 26?^(\it is a bit confusing for sure*)*
On the case of Linux, the barrier starts when you notice it's a kernel and not a system: it's not simply "Install Linux" and you'll soon have LinuxOS 25, you'll have to decide yourself which distro you choose out of probably hundreds (mostly based out of others)
The people putting SteamOS together aren't GNU religious nutcases so there is hope there.
Even Linus himself says SteamOS is the only way he can seem Linux on the desktop.
[Question removed as duplicate]
You're punching shadows bro. Also there isn't a "linux community" like it's a pub or something lol. There hundreds of different linux OSes, all with different websites and groups etc.
"so which OS is best for my usecase? i need to use office obviously, maybe with some photoshop editing and pdf making"
"nah, too confusing, I'm going back to windows/mac os"
Last panel should have been “The machine malfunctioned and took us to the future”
I actually just switched my desktop from Windows to PopOS
What's with all of the "HAHAHA LINUX SUCKS RIGHT GUYS?!?!" posts lately? I see literally no actual pro-linux spam in comparison to all of these types of posts
I don't think this post either pro-linux or anti-linux. "The year of the Linux desktop" is just a funny meme by now, people both inside and outside of the Linux community make fun of it.
Apparently some Microsoft bros are getting butthurt at people finally trying Linux now that Windows 11 has shit the bed so hard.
yeah, weird
Linux is ok. It has its purposes. It's just never going to be a good end replacement as a desktop OS for general usage.
Windows dominates the business environment and to a lesser degree OSX is used. Linux tends to be in more server environments but that's about it
"This year"
There won't be a year of the Linux desktop. Linux will simply be there to catch all the users jumping off the Windows ship as Microsoft sinks it into the darkest depths.
That's funny you think Microsoft is going anywhere.https://m.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/MSFT/microsoft/revenue
This subreddit is having a meltdown over Linux's growth in the wake of Microsoft shitting the bed with Windows 11, huh?
Oh no, we didn't time travel, we changed timelines entirely!
I hope when SteamOS launches for desktop that incentivizes more people to use Linux. Yeah, it's a bit of a learning curve but if you had never used Windows that would be as well.
Should have asked how long it was since the epoch
Only if you don’t care the diff between 1970 and 2038
Just wait till it rolls over and your IoT toaster thinks it’s 1901.
Y38 doesn’t have the same ring to it 😔
We will have to worry about Y4k probably
And/or explodes
We somehow survived Y2K, so we will certainly survive the epoch rollover somehow.
Are there any 32bit systems still in production? I feel like they're already phased out, and definitely will be by 2038.
I would assume older ATMs are on their way to 64bit if they aren't already.
Steam still runs in 32bit mode. Wouldn't be surprised if there are still legacy software systems using 32bit epoch in 2038
Afaik python's date and time system is still 32 bit too, tho that might have changed since I read about it
TONS of 32 bit (and even older) systems are in production.
Not long ago I migrated a windows 2000 server running on a pentium 4 to GCP.
The second or the third one?
lmao imagine confusing time travelers with seconds since 1970. way more brutal than just asking the year
32 or 64 bits?
Yes
True, nothing like measuring time in seconds since 1970 to keep things clear and human-readable.
2038