nba
[Windhorst] “I have talked to other teams who have said they (Boston) are actively trying to trade Anfernee Simons"..."Whether they can or not is another [thing]."
![[Windhorst] “I have talked to other teams who have said they (Boston) are actively trying to trade Anfernee Simons"..."Whether they can or not is another [thing]."](https://external-preview.redd.it/gHmVvU28qaYsWDHw4bMs7qlXaFHKrsiyTDAIGbDoE5s.jpeg?auto=webp&s=e54302cac1ad6b0805d34889aa3a7f9e06fb2396)
Seems like this won't be something that is a good fit for the Celtics going forward.
Simons, who is represented by Bill Duffy, is on an expiring contract worth $27.7 million.
Discussion
Kuzma straight up take it or leave it Brad
Pairing Kuzma and Tatum up together.
We can finally find out who is the better of the two.
Not sure what we could really learn that that old graphic didn't already tell us...
I bet you that Kuzma is better. He'll average more points/rebounds/assists/3's than Tatum for the 25-26 NBA season.
/s
Stop being a coward and get rid of the /s
We all know Kuzma is better
Evil way to return that old Tatum\Kuzma comparison graphic lol
Kuzma did put up a '26 Tatum statline in the playoffs
Thank you for the /s, otherwise I would’ve thought you were being serious!
Celts should get Fultz, Embiid, Kuzma and Lonzo
Tatum in wheelchair is still better than Kuz
This trade works and allows Boston to clear 5M more salary which the bucks have no problem taking on 👀
There are so many meh players making 30m on capped teams that’s Kuz probably has a little trade value now
RJ's ears are burning.
I feel like RJ is on a whole different level of player than Kuzma and Simons though, overpay aside.
Eh, not really. He's very much an empty calorie kind of player, high volume, no defence scorer. His playmaking is decent, but not enough to make up for his massive limitations.
He's just the usual starter on a bad team, bench player on a good team, type guy.
Kuzma has another year of salary and is a worse player, I think brad would just prefer to pay a second to dump Niang somewhere.
Could make it a 3 team trade with the Blazers.
Anfernee to Bucks.
Kuzma + Celtics 2031 2nd round pick to Blazers
Timelord + Thybulle to Celtics
Excuse you lol I promise you Joe Cronin does not want kuzma anywhere near this team
Two expirings for an extra year of a player we don’t want + a future 2nd round pick.
Gotta figure out a way to get Jrue in there again for the hot potato laughs
Oh that’s some good fun right there
Wait, does that work? I love that. I think Thybulle and Timelord are both on expirings so from a C’s perspective it’s golden
No chance - Simons is expiring, Kuzma is not.
Bucks also really need better guards. Why not? Boston can move Kuz again next year.
Kyle “Tony Snell” Kuzma
I think the Bucks would absolutely take that
It would be Simons vs Trent competition, part deux! Portland chose Ant over Gary. What will the Bucks do?
They’d probably both start quite honestly
Don’t think there’s any chance we get Simons anyway though
Need a sweetener to help Boston get out of the 2nd apron
Boston is already out of the second apron
If Boston is still over the cap they might do this since Kuzma is $5 million dollars cheaper this coming season.
Terry rozier straight up take it or leave it Brad
Brad's press conference from yesterday seemed to imply that they need to take into account the repeater tax, but that he has permission from Chisholm to stay in the tax if the only way out is to use assets to get under the tax.
If we are a tax team this year, Simons + guys like Niang/Hauser/Davison become potential trade chips to aggregate for a player at a position of need, (i.e. center). That's 49mil in salary they can match. Likely at the deadline so we can fill the roster out with pro-rated min contracts and stay below the 2nd apron.
Plan A is probably getting below the tax without using up any assets, but Plan B seems to be remaining a tax team and maybe be competitive
With the question marks around Indiana, MIL, and Miami, and the likely minimal at best jumps from charlotte and washington, you guys are still almost definitely a playoff team next season even without Tatum.
You won't be title threats (well, most likely) but a first round victory is definitely still doable. So Plan B is absolutely a valid way to go.
you guys are still almost definitely a playoff team next season
I disagree. With JB and D-White playing 70 games sure, but makes no sense to grind them in a DOA season coming off multiple deep playoff runs, and without them the team is bleak.
The warriors showed how it’s done tbh; take a gap year, reload mentally and asset wise and run it back
Praying for this (and for Boston native AJ Dybansta... Silver's got to fix the next two drafts so that all the good players land in the East).
I can't believe we've gotten to a point where playing 70 games is used as a point to define "grinding" players.
Did you not witness the plethora of injuries to star players last year from overuse?
"If 5 people get hurt, and 300 do not, that's a sign of an injury problem."
You make a pretty dumb point once you consider the 5 that were injured are all near the top of minutes played and usage on their bodies (aka the entire point of the load management/grinding discussion)
If 5 people with heavy usage get hurt, and 300 without heavy usage do not, that's a sign that usage/minutes are correlated to injury.
When's the last time you saw a low minute bench warmer tear his Achilles? And how many off the injuries recently have been players with heavy minutes? Pretty wild that you didn't make that connection tbh.
JD is nonguaranteed, right?
Sounds like a nice and competent owner, must be nice
Niang has no value, probably has negative value. I have no idea who Davison is. Hauser may have a bit of value.
Hauser definitely has value. He's on an incredible contract.
JD Davison is a PG that kills it in the G League (MVP) and then shits himself when in NBA games. Still super young and cheap as hell so who knows if someone would try and take a flyer
Niang is neutral value due to being an expiring contract and it being a deadline move. Hauser has value and Simons probably has neutral value unless he's ok with a long-term/team friendly contract to be a super 6th man. Davison is a min contract likely to be nothing
Those are just players to match salary. The value in the trade would come from the 2first rounders the Celtics can trade.
Edit:
2 not 3 first rounders
I thought it’s just 1) 2026 or 2027 and 2) 2031 they have available?
With 2028 being a lightly protected swap with San Antonio, 2029 owed to Portland outright, 2030 Stepien’d because of that and 2032 being 2025 2nd apron frozen.
"Hauser may have a bit of value" you just discredited all your other opinions by missing how glaring obvious it is that Hauser has a *lot* of value on an insane contract. Elite 3 and D guy.
JD Davison is a super promising prospect. He came out too early but he’s insanely athletic and has all the tools. Just needs reps.
Celtics though are in a pretty great spot asset wise for a post-title team, wouldn't be the worst thing to lose a random future first
If we could aggregate salaries effectively, I’d love him as a 6th man. We can’t though, we used those deadweight contracts in the Porzingis trade
Simons for Porzingis? 👀
Can’t imagine porzingis as a Celtic
Quick someone photoshop Tingus in a C’s uniform
Woah there, Porzingis as a Celtic? Just don’t see it
We’d love him as a 6th man too. But he don’t want that
If I’m Atlanta, and I don’t have to give away core guys, I’d take the risk and go into the tax. He’s playing for a contract, and I think he and Trae can share the floor in regular season matchups if the front court is Risacher, JJ, and KP. Swiss cheese defensively but that lineup would blow teams out the water offensively for 8-10 minutes a night
East is wide open, Hawks could use one more power move to compete. If it doesn’t work out, both KP and Simons are expirings
Isn’t NAW your 6th man? Kennard?
other than trae and bufkin (if he plays) we have literally nobody to reliably create their own shot. between NAW, kennard, dyson, and JJ we have enough creation outside of trae but we definitely need another bucket getter. like if we were able to bring caris back that would have been amazing
Yeah but neither are high level on ball creators. Caris was at least above average at it, but Malik Beasley threw a wrench in our plans of retaining him
I think Simons might be a little better than Sexton, but they're similar players and the Jazz had to attach picks to trade Sexton. Not much of a market for score first, small guards
Is it just me or it feels like teams only view players as either max players or minimum role players, how’s a 25 y/o making 25 million putting up 20ppg considered having no value?
Because there’s a lot of guys in the league who can put up 20 ppg on a bad team with the green light.
Cam Thomas - "Excuse me?"
Kuminga - “Am I joke to you?”
He is objectively an elite shooter that would be deadly running off picks for every team in the league. Personally I don't understand how he wouldn't have SOME value as off ball PG on a team with a ball dominant star. He is very fast and literally one of the 10-15 best pure 3pt shooters in the league
He has some value. Just in between the $27m he’s paid and the $3.5m a guy like GTJ gets you.
Like what would you be happy as an extension for Simons?
He's not really a point guard. More of an undersized sg that is not a good defender. 20 ppg on average efficiency. There is not much value in that in today's CBA.
That’s my point tho, apron stuff has butchered value of these players, before any players putting up 20ppg on mid level salary would have some sort of value
I think its more that the league has changed. We used to value volume scoring, but now if you don't play defense and can't pass it's not that valuable of a skill. The league has been trending away from players like Simons for years now.
27 million is a mid level salary?
The average salary last year was 11 mil.
The non tax payer mid level exception is 14 mil.
He’s making 27.7 He’s making starter money, all star money, and he’s not that.
Starter money, not close to all-star money
Gary Trent is a similar player and he had similar value a couple years ago. It's not really a new cba issue.
A lot of young shoot-first/no-defense players might get a good first extension based on potential but if they don't grow to be more than a shoot-first/no-defense player, their market value often comes back down.
Because he gives up 20 ppg and doesn't make his teammates better.
Because he’s a one trick pony. He’s an undersized 2 that doesn’t create for others and doesn’t play a lick of defense.
I’d like to see what he looks like on our roster. It’s a lost season.
Because the stats are empty. A guy like Maxey or Brunson does about the same thing, they contribute to winning and give you some level of defense. Simons does nothing for winning and isn’t even a decent team defender.
Stats can be very misleading when looked at in a vacuum.
That’s putting it lightly. He’s a bottom 3 defender in the entire league. Not just bad. But horrendously bad
Cause putting up 20 on 20 shots and doing nothing else isn’t actually that valuable. It’s debatable how valuable it was in the past. but a lot of players could do it if they had the chance
It’s a combo of the new CBA and players trying to get a MAX contract even when they’re not worth it. Teams can’t just say fuck it, you’re on the roster we can pay you whatever and take the tax hit. Things have changed. The players always wanting top money hasn’t but what will in the next couple years. Players will start realizing that there isn’t as much money out there anymore. Teams can MAX 2 players if their vets and maybe 3 if they’re all on a rookie MAX. After that, they’re not handing out large contracts for flawed players or role players. You’ll see the next tier after MAX will be around the 20 range and then after that a hard decline to MLE or rookie contracts. You can’t have 4 or 5 players making top dollar. Celtics have large commitments to Tatum/Brown and White is in the next range. Simmons would need to take a cut or at least re-up on 20ish deal for the Celtics to maintain him and they’d have to feel that he’ll put them over the top. They likely would rather allocate that money to a big than a G.
Sam Hauser could probably average 20 if he shot at that volume
It'd only be surprising Windy said we had actually decided to keep Simons.
We already knew Simons would most likely be dealt. If not now, then by the trade deadline.
I mean, even if they trade him for another bad contract they badly need another big.
Hot take maybe but with another decent big even without Tatum you're still a 50 win team.
Maaaaaaybe without just JT, but now we're going to be missing KP, Jrue, & Kornet, as well, and probably Al, too. Maybe even Hauser gets dealt.
Hard to see 50 wins coming from that. We have no depth now.
No shot, this team has no depth, and no PFs/Cs. Lost 4-5 good defenders too.
Their defense without those guys is still better than the Lakers.
Smells like a “Bulls send next year’s 1st Round pick” type of deal.
Hey! Just be happy they are finally making trades, and this one includes a draft pick!
Lmao good luck we’ve been trying to trade him for some time now. Thanks for taking him off our hands I guess?
I was just thinking this is very ironic considering one of the justifications for the Blazers doing this trade is Jrue will "have more trade value to a contender at the deadline" which may be true, but just funny seeing Boston immediately try to flip him.
Wonder if they finally watched some film on him and were like...hey wait a minute
I assume the team valued having an expiring more than getting a few seconds and another large contract sitting on the books. If they can flip him great, if not oh well.
I mean the obvious use of Simons for Boston is to have him help run the offense for a year while Tatum is out, then just let his money expire. They are trying to lower the tax burden and getting his contract off the books helps with that. Kind of surprised they are trying to trade him based on that
We have a glaring need at the center position, it’s currently looking like our starting center is Quetta, which is … something.
I assume they are trying to address that, and if they can’t they are proceeding with the run down you gave.
Any chance Boston just tanks this year and tries to get a top pick?
I think it’s a possibility but less so than many Celtics fans are hoping for. It’s hard to say. Brad runs a great FO so there is no way it’s out of the question.
I think if we get dealt another big blow injury wise (Brown or White), we will blow it up. Other than that, I just don’t see Brown, White and PP as players or Mazzulla as a coach who won’t want to try to compete no matter what the situation.
Nah I think they just know they have until the deadline to flip him or that cap space goes bye bye if he walks next offseason. Since they are still a tax team currently. Their hope is that there is an all starish or close type player that becomes available so they can add that piece for the 26' season when Tatum is back while also getting below the aprons.
I don't know how they will get below the aprons with Tatum, Brown, and an "all star-ish" player on the books
Thanks for taking the older, more expensive guy on a longer contract off our hands.
We can afford the money though (under luxury and 1st apron with Jrue), and he's better than Ant.
Mutually beneficial then.
Hopefully...a lot depends on Jrue being able to play at a decent level.
But yeah, this was never a home run kind of trade for either team. Just weird money and lineup issues forcing kind of a lateral trade for each team.
Yeah I’m so happy this isn’t our problem anymore lol
Why did they let Jrue go anyway?
second apron
Plus he was due another 100+ million and his in 30s coming off a clear regression last season.
I think given that Simons is on a reasonable expiring salary some team will want him even if they don't want to give him the longer term contract he wants. The question is what could The Celtics get that would actually be worth it for them? Is another slightly smaller expiring that saves 3-5 million on the cap this year (not sure if that moves the needle tax wise or puts them under the first apron) and a couple of second round picks really worth it? If the Celtics want a 1st or something of value they might be better off starting him and trying to flip him at the deadline unless the tax ramifications are really that bad for them.
Anfernee for Smart plz and thank you. Wizards get a better, young player. Celtics shed $6M from salary and get their guy back
No thanks, we like Smart teaching the young guys and we don't need any more guards
How about Kuzma instead?
We good on that big bro.
Our team is ridiculously young and we need real vets who have been been through it all to guide them. Would much rather Smart mentor our kids, especially the guards, than Simons.
What is Anf’s value right now? Which teams might want him?
Honestly I don’t think he has any, otherwise he wouldn’t have been traded for Jrue. Shot chuckers on expensive contracts are deadweight in 2025.
probably nothing given what we just saw for norm. dude doesn't play good enough d for a contender to bite as a starter and makes too much money coming off the bench.
not sure what the kings are doing but a swap for DeRozan would be interesting. Boston saves some money and kings lose a year of salary.
Honestly makes sense for us. I could see it.
Would kill me as a Raptors fan to see DeMar on the Celtics
Best bet is go into the season with him and let him show his skills as a combo guard and some improvement on D on a hopefully competitive team and hope that there’s some fringe playoff team that is desperate for perimeter scoring come trade deadline szn.
It would take an amazing feat just to turn him from one of the worst defenders in the league to just a bad one lol
Zero.
Trade him for a center, please.
brah y cant we js keep him n see how he goes. In brad we trust
He’s a very talented player. I feel like I’m in the minority thinking he’s not just a chucker
He's definitely better than his reputation. He's a pretty complete 3-level scorer, he was just asked to do too much for the Blazers. If he's not the #1 option on offense I think he'll much show better efficiency. The more legit criticisms are that he's small and not a great defender, but this past season he poured way more effort into defense and was sometimes not a glaring liability on that end.
OK I dont want to come off as a hater here, but lets be real ok. Ant is a phenomenal shooter. Like wow from deep. He is NOT a 3 level scorer. He never gets to the rim, his finishing in the lane is atrocious and he doesn't get to the line. I'll agree they asked him to do too much. He isn't a PG and shouldn't be running an offense. He should just be an off ball scorer.
He is small for his position yes. And you can say he poured more effort into defense if thats what the eye test tells you, but statistically he was a bottom 5 defender in the NBA overall. Not exaggerating, I believe he was the 4th worst in the league. He was #1 worst last year. So while effort may have gone up, results did not.
Disagree on the "atrocious" assessment of his finishing. He has shown tons of creative finishes, he suffers due to size and other teams being able to pack the paint because we have too few other shooters. He faced a ton of defensive focus from opponents in general, which will definitely not be the case on a team like Boston.
That doesn't negate the fact he is less than 50% finishing at the rim. Which is.. not good. I agree he COULD be a good mid range or rim finisher with his athleticism, but he tried to be a Dame clone and he isn't a good enough ball handler or finisher.
I do imagine he will do much better in Boston, I agree there for sure. Assuming he plays there and isn't flipped again to get them under the 2nd apron.
Simons is worse than his reputation I think. He’s supposedly an offensive specialist, but the Blazers were worse across the board on O-rating when playing lineups with him on the floor.
Alleged bust Scoot Henderson is a better player right now.
As I said, he'll be better off not playing the role of primary scorer. A big reason our offense suffered with him was that he was asked to run the show whenever he was on the court.
Anyone who still thinks Scoot is a bust just hasn't been watching our games.
He’s not a chucker, he can create his own shot, get to the rim and facilitate pretty well. Probably better as a 2 than a point guard but he’s perfectly capable of running the offense. He’s just been in a bad situation.
My opinion of him will always be high when I saw him play against the Heat 2 years ago. He was legitimately the only offensive player on that team had those two games who could do anything. If he didn’t take a shot, the blazers had no chance of scoring. I saw the Heat legitimately leave multiple players open to just double him and get the ball out of his hands.
Plus last season, I believe he saw one of the highest percentages of blitz/doubles coverage. I mean, he was up there with Brunson, Luka and LeBron. He’s a very good and efficient scorer
Classic "good stats on a bad team" guy.
He is a top tier shooter. Takes a lot of contested shots and makes them at a high rate. Not worth his contract but he’s absolutely a decent player.
He’s good on the offensive side (tho doesn’t do much for others). And horrible on the defensive side. We were 8-4 last year in the games he missed. He’s just not a guy that makes the team better.
Yea but he’s actually a pretty good scorer. Can shoot the hell out of the ball too. For being on a bad team he’s always been pretty efficient.
Is it a salary dump or just trying to get back a better price to win?
They’re going to look for picks and a player, but they’re better off doing it at the trade deadline when Simons is averaging 20+ on an expiring deal, when teams will actively be shopping for a shooter or spark plug.
If Simon’s will be traded he won’t be moved till the deadline. Boston will attempt to turn him into a winning player and make him passable on defense. If that works they will probably keep him, if that doesn’t work they’ll probably flip him at the deadline. He’s going to look much better as a second/third option than as a first option.
Windhorstian: “Whether they can or not…”
They should keep him, he can provide valuable scoring
why do they have to trade him tho? i thought Celtics would be the team to hide his defensive flaws. and they're not gonna be contending without Tatum anyways. he's an expiring. 1 yr and he's off the books
Blazers rush a trade for mediocre value then the Celtics take the whole summer to actually maximize the asset. I'll be fuming if they get a young player out of this deal.
If we can't trust IQ to stay healthy, I'd trade RJ for him
Haha nice try, but no thanks
Simons and a pick to CHI for Vucevic
I thought Boston would wanna keep him so they could remain somewhat competitive but it’s gonna be a gap year, I should have figure with them getting Niang and Minott.
Would love him in the wolves. Not sure if we have anyone to match that will not affect our team composition.
I wonder what his next contract is gonna be. Seems like there isn't much value in these 6'2" - 6'3" combo guards that play no defense. Sexton was traded for nothing. Monk not having much of a trade market and the Celtics are trying to trade Simons again.
They must also be the easiest archetype to find in the league
And it's an archetype whose ceiling is usually 6th man.
I don't think this is the problem, you have guys like Donovan Mitchell that are close to this archetype while still being really good. I think the problem is more that the archetype needs a ton of shots to be useful, so either you're a superstar and the team can justify giving you a ton of shots, or you're not and you don't really fit in the starting lineup.
All that is to say that it's not that the ceiling is too low, it's that there's a giant plateau at 6th man, because the vast majority of good-but-not-great players in this archetype cannot thrive as simply "good starters"
Mitchell also had a ridiculous wingspan for his height, which helps a ton
And is a big body who is also hyper athletic. Simons is athletic, but also like 185lbs, without true point guard skills to make up for the lack of size.
I don’t think it’s wanting a lot of shots of anything…I think it’s mostly an efficiency thing. The combo of bad defense and not being an efficient offense piece is a double whammy. If you just look at points/ast Trae seems valuable. Step back and see he’s taking a bunch of shots to get there and giving up a ton on defense/turnovers and those basic numbers look a lot less impressive. Part of what makes Steph so good is the efficiency. Guys like that become a smaller problem on bench where scoring is more useful and they aren’t getting exposed as much by 2nd unit guys on other team. Teams are much more efficient than they used to be so being a chucker is harder to overcome there days.
And we've seen where Donovan Mitchell being your best player gets you.
As a Cavs fan, yes. They built a great team that lacks that forward sized super star player. Need to come off one of their bigs.
Like Lou Will 🎵
Send him to Brooklyn with a FRP. We can absorb him entirely into cap space with a little work.
You guys are basically becoming the NBA’s landfill
Just in the middle of Nets Stage 3 of 4.
1 Waste assets on an unholy superteam -> 2 blow it up in disgrace -> 3 shamelessly suck for years and build an intriguing young roster -> 4 Sell the team to a Foreign Oligarch -> Rinse and repeat
The Brooklyn Way
Aren't you cheerful
Sadly, this is the way…
I would guess that Boston wouldn't trade this year's pick and so most of our FRPs are likely to be late firsts. Also Simmons could actually be useful to them, hurting the tank. So while I would Love to do that, I don't think Nets will be very interested
Simons is an expiring so I would rather just wait the year and not have to lose the first round pick. I think we should trade niang and a 2nd and take back a small amount of salary to sneak under the cap. Next year we want all the flexibility we can keep and have all of our assets to make some trades to contend
You’d love to give the Nets a FRP? I wouldn’t.
not giving you a frp for an expiring come on now lol
Dude's an expiring lol. you not getting a frp for that
Our local dipshit Danny Marang said he’d get over $30 million a year. I’m inclined to think closer to $10 million.